Lancia Motor Club

My S1 Fulvia was put on the road after a lengthy rest in time for the Turin celebrations in '06.  She got there and back with no problems but the heater matrix gave up the ghost a week after getting back and then the lights went a bit screwy.  So I let the Sept 07 MOT slip by and let her rest for the winter.  Now, with lights fixed and the matrix re-cored, she has just acquired another year of MOT, and I've enjoyed the last few weeks... to a degree.

The only problem is that during her time inside my parent's garage, sat alongside such mundane machinery as a Flymo and a Homebase strimmer, the old girl has got a bit depressed and now has a chronic drinking habit.  The last two times I've gone to the petrol station I've put £15 of fuel in (good for half a tank) but only managed 80 miles.  You can practically see the gauge moving toward empty.  What's going on?  The choke isn't on (and I know this because when it is on it makes a noise like a miniature steam train), I'm not driving like I'm being chased by the fuzz, the fuel hoses are new, the tank looks okay, there's no smell of fuel in the garage and no fuel sitting in the tray under the solex carbs.

Does anyone have any pointers?  Could it be fuel thieves syphoning a little each journey to avoid detection?  I was planning to drive the Fulvia to Portugal at Christmas, but I'd have to sell my parent's house to afford the likely fuel bill to do it!

Blimy Mark,
 I wish I could half fill my tank for £15! working it out in my head (I can't find my calculator) I think that works out at about 13 litres, say 3 gallons, or about 22mpg which is a bit on the low side,  even my 2c who is a bit of a weighty girl does better than that at about 25 mpg, sure the brakes aren't rubbing? are the tyres up to pressure, air cleaner ok?
Driving to Portugal, Oh what memories of 2004 & Esphino on one of Frank Dehlers European Tours :)

Brian
8227 8)

Mark,
You might have a fuel leak which only occurs under pressure, ie when the engine is running, so between pump and carbs.  This seems more likely than the conspiracy theory involving the lawnmower and the strimmer, and is the sort of problem that could develop during a long lay-up when a hose deteriorates.  22 mpg in normal driving is certainly heavy, and if that much fuel was actually being fed through the carbs you would feel and smell it.
Stuart Wilkinson

Mark

Not sure I agree with the calculations of mpg so far - £15 of petrol @ £1.17 per litre is 12.82 litres.

There are roughly 4.54 litres in a gallon - so thats 2.82 gallons.   80 miles to 2.82 gallons is 28 mpg.....

Can anyone see any errors in my logic?

Duncan

Duncan,
My thoughts exactly. The Fulvia tank is a about 40 Litres from memory so filling it half full would be about £25, £15 is only about a 3rd of a tank now. 28 mpg seems ok to me for a 1.6 (?)  ???
Neil

Hey .You think you have a problem, try an MGC Roadster, normal driving around here is 17mpg  :o :o  My 1600hf does around 22 25 mpg sensible ish driving. ;)

Did you work it out with a calculator?
Wasn't meant to be exact, but on reflection I can see that 80 divided by 3 doesn't equal 22 :-[ my old brain doesn't work too well in litres, but my maths normally aren't that bad :o

Brian
8227 8)

[/quote]

Did you work it out with a calculator?
Wasn't meant to be exact, but on reflection I can see that 80 divided by 3 doesn't equal 22 :-[ my old brain doesn't work too well in litres, but my maths normally aren't that bad :o

Brian
8227 8)
[/quote]

What makes you think that!  :) - nothing wrong with a set of log tables / slide rule..................  ;D

Just as well I didn't use a slide rule as I would have probably made it -50mpg ;D

Brian
8227 8)

Wow chaps - thanks for the responses  ;D

Firstly, the local morrisons petrol station sells at 1.15 (or it was a week ago) and that got the indicator to a gnat's whisker under the 1/2 full marker.  the tank is 38 litres, but I've never managed to put that much in.

Regardless of where the marker goes, the cals you guys made paints a truer picture... 28mpg.  (BTW, calculator or not, your maths skills are better than mine).  28mpg is the same as my Barchetta which is a 1.75 litre variable valve rev-lover which spends all it's life on the red line - the Fulvia is a 1.3.

Given that the fuel hoses are new (new for Turin trip) I might investigate the clips - the loss of fuel under pressure might well be the culprit.

However, given that I haven't filled her up completely, perhaps I ought to do so and see what I get... she used to manage more than the Barchetta (250 miles from a tank)

Thanks again guys

When I used to rally my series 3 it did about 27mpg going to work but a tankful of petrol was all gone in ninety miles during a rally.  If the organisers said that i should carry enough fuel to do 100 miles (or more) I had to stow a petrol can in the boot (most against the regulations).

The tank only ever once got empty, the red (or was it yellow) light used to come on with more than a gallon still in.

BTW I would have thought you'd smell a petrol leak.  Perhaps not when driving but whenever you came to a halt for a junction or traffic lights.  But maybe my nose is more sensitive to the smell of octane...

Neil

I generally average around 30mpg in the 1.6 hf Fulvia,28mpg in the Monte and about 22mpg in the 16v Integrale. :o

I was just thinking that this would be a useful matrix to put on the web site / wiki site at some point in the future : roughly how many miles / kms you'd expect to get from a tankful when driving sensibly or enthusiastically for each model of car.

Useful thought for the day ! :)

400KM from the integrale on French motorways ...

(400 kilometers = 248.548477 miles according to Google)

(Type in "400 km in miles" in a Google search box and you'll see what I mean - REALLY useful feature !!!!)

A matrix would be very useful indeed, listing each car derivative with 'lead foot', 'everyday' and 'long cruise' entries - I nominate Sparehead 3 to compile the spreadsheet for the Forum ;D

Thank you Marky - I'll create a separate topic and everyone can contribute ... then I can compile a spreadsheet (which I'll pop back into the thread) ... watch this (cyber)space

In normal use I used to get about 35mpg from a 1.3 and 22 from a 1.6. I'd do a brim to brim measurement and if you are lucky you might just find that the gauge is not all that accurate...
Good luck

So if we're expanding this out to other Lancias...

My first 8-valve integrale did 23 mpg on the run to work and back.  The best I ever saw was 28mpg pootling around the roads of Wales on holiday with the family on board; I was astounded since most of that was done in a third gear.  On a night road rally I work on 15 mpg to estimate how much fuel to put in.  One thing that's better than my old Fulvia is that it'll do a whole 150 mile event without needing filling up when my Fulvia always needed to stop at the petrol halt.

The worst I had in that car was less than 2mpg competing on an Autosolo.  It did about 4 miles at full chat which left 70 miles of petrol missing from the tank when compared against normal running.  It also ruined the front tyres rubbing the lettering away half way up the sidewalls (set at 40psi).  That was running a Power Boost fuel pressure regulator, not a part I'd recommend to anyone :-\

My new integrale (still an 8-valve) started off at 22mpg but, with the fitting of a Stack Lambda gauge I've been able to adjust the fuel pressure down a bit and now get 24.5mpg which is a 10% improvement.  And it'll still do a sustained 130mph (not at 24.5mpg!!!) so the fuelling can't be wrong and there may be scope to improve that further.  When I've finished I'll measure the fuel pressure and let you know what it's set at.

Neil

The gauge could well be completely wrong, but that doesn't change the fact that I only get 80 miles from 12 litres.  You were getting 35mpg from your 1.3, so mine should be there or there abouts.  Perhaps I ought to take the upright piano off the roof rack when I drive around  ::)

I'm only a little way off, and I'd been told that she was running a little rich - perhaps it had always been like that but I'd never noticed prior to petrol going over a pound a litre.

If one good thing comes from this thread, it'll be a useful matrix... just don't use my car as the basis for the 1.3 Fulvia data Sparehead  ;)

I am surprised nobody has suggested entering the Cotswold Economy Drive. Around 120 miles of varied country motoring where you can compare results. There are six places left. Latest entry is a Saab Sonnet. 

hi Lima,

In my view it would be worth taking out a second mortgage & filling the tank, and comparing the results brim to brim. Otherwise you can't be precisely sure about how much fuel is used for a particular distance. If you are lucky you might find that the results are not too bad (or they coudl be terrible!)

Best wishes
jai

Peter, I'd love to enter the CED but we're away this on holiday this year (again!) ... next year we'll go earlier or later and make sure we're there ... (even if we need a second mortage!)

Whoops. Try again!

Have a good holiday and lets hope we both get lots of sunshine

Just to add a bit more useless information. This year I have done four sprints in my road car, an Alfa 147 1.9 Turbo D with 150bhp instead of the Fulvia until I can rebuild my engine. On the road it does the usual diesel act of retunring over 45 mpg but on a sprint I got it down to 15mpg which compairs well with 2 mpg from a petrol engine. Handy having the electronic buttons to get the exact readings!
It was fun but not as satisfying to drive fast as the Fulvia but fitting the Q2 LSD to the torquey Alfa gave it grip in the tight wet corners and stopped the wild scrabbling.
Chris

How's the matrix coming along? It must be quite comprehensive by now Steve  ;)