Lancia Motor Club

What is the market rate for these at the moment?  A 1961 2.5. LHD. Struturally and mechanically good but with tired paint?

There are a few for sale in Europe at the moment, prices range from 12,000 to 20,000euros for nice ones (well thats what the discriptions say!) so somewhere around the £10K should be about right. Don't forget they were very expensive when new so are not cheap to fix if there are any issues. Pay careful attention to the lower front ball joints and brakes both very expensive to sort out.

Thanks for the reply. I've noticed this one :

http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C65241/

Opening price from seller is £10,200.  So perhaps price is about right. One to ponder. Have fancied one of these for a long while but not sure I have the "guts" to take the plunge. Bad enough trying to source spares for the 2000 coupe, never mind one of these!

Go for it Lindsay!
 
I had a similar dilemma over my Dilambda, dreamed for years of owning a vintage Lancia and when finally everything fell into place, taking the plunge wasn't exactly easy, especially convincing Margaret!
 
Now? Modestine is very much the other lady in my life and despite all the ups and downs (very down at the moment!) I wouldn't be without her.

And, as far as parts are concerned they don't come much more difficult than a Dilambda but its proved to be definitely a case of were there's a will there's a way.
 
Oh, and here's what I took on!
 
Robin.

Just be a little careful, sounds very much like the one that was for sale at the NEC in November, unfortunately I can't find my photo of it the check the registration number; The one at the NEC was a similar prices and if it is the same car, they are being somewhat economical with the truth to say the least with the description of the paintwork.
I didn't seem in bad condition otherwise so I suppose if you factor in the cost of a good respray it would still be worth having.

Just found my photos and it is the same car, photos are not very good but enough in one to see the condition of the paintwork :'(

Brian
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Hi Brian - one of the great benefits of being into Lancias is the folk who you can talk to who know most of the cars in the UK!!!

Given the state of the paintwork....and in fairness they aren't saying it is good - what should be a fair price? 

The paint on the front wing is as bad.

Apparently much work done by Richard Thorne...........take from that what you will.......

Having owned all the various variants of Flaminia I would say that the Coupe is the best of the bunch...........so go for it!

Lindsay,
I would agree with Ade, as long as you go into with your eyes open I would say the asking price is fair, it's certainly usable as it is, but I can't see you driving it too long before the paintwork would offend, ( it certainly would me!) then your into a possible £5-6K respray, what does a good respray cost these days?  but the Flaminia PF itself, Magic ;D although my pechant as usual is for Berlinas :D

Brian
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Horses for courses me thinks.
Whilst not denying that there is a great deal of pleasure in owning a car with pristine paintwork it won't make any difference to the driving experience. David Mead has an Augusta in far from concours condition but the charm it exudes and the pleasure he gets from driving and fettling it is palpable.

It reminds me of when I hankered after a V12 Ferrari and all I could afford was a bottom of the pile 250 GTE. Admittedly it was in very good condition but the point is that it had that glorious engine and cache and if you closed your eyes when starting it up it could have been a 250 GTO or LM!

I've owned and driven on a daily basis a number of scruffy Lancia and never regretted it for the shear delight in ownership. A Flaminia PF Coupe is a thing of beauty in my eyes whatever the condition and this one looks to be an eminent candidate for a rolling restoration. At the right price, and I don't know what that is, it has to be worth a go.

Robin. 

I agree with robin, rolling restorations are great fun, look at my augusta, bought very cheap, needed work, scruffy bodilly and interior but gives you great satisfaction doing a bit that improves it and still able to drive it round, i'm pretty fanatical when i do a restorations (so i'm told  ::)) and the cars i've done in the past i've been accused of going a little OTT with them, however i enjoy building cars to the best of my ability, getting back to the point though when i bought the augusta it gave me by far the biggest smile out of all my cars and yet was probably the roughest out of them all, its still far from concours , my dads car is concours but truth be known i prefere mine as its a bit like my famous trousers ....... comfortable  :D , i sold an absolutly mint fulvia to buy it, most thought i was insane because of the differance in condition between the 2 but i've got what i wanted and 2yrs on i'm still grinning , if its what you want GET IT BOUGHT!!! another may not be round the corner!!! good luck

I don't disagree with Robin, Chugga or anyone else for that matter, and it isn't the first time I've driven wrecks purely for the pleasure to be derived from the experience itself, including a 1932 Austin 10/4 back in the 1950's that my brother, for reasons known only to himself, had painted Lilac and black!

But something clearly as nice as the PF, my preference would be to see it looking as it once no doubt did.
Each to his own.

Brian
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There will always be a huge premium on a really properly restored car, which is why I bought the Aurelia everyone else was walking past and had an enormous amount of fun from it.  With paint like that you'll be WILLING other drivers to hit you so you can get some of it done on their insurance.  You'll not worry about supermarket car parks, you'll leave it in the street visiting friends, stone chips won't notice.  Odds on you'll use it more with paint like that than with a 6K bill fresh in the memory.  Its also that class of car where the paint condition matters a lot less than, for example, a Sierra where it "being a well kept and completely straight example" might be all that makes it special.  A Flamina in ANY condition is a rare and special car.

The big "but" is to take it for a drive and make sure its alive.  With Aurelias problems with brakes and driveline are all too obvious and getting it all to work properly can be a long haul.  Lots of "freshly restored" cars turned out to be complete dogs: the metal and paint is really only half the job.

The best advice I had was from John Savage - "does it have an MOT, has it done some recent milage".  Cars like this don't wear out, its lack of use that's the real killer.

Others will have to give you the "what to look out for" list - but I'd be surprised if it wasn't immediately obvious from a short test drive if it was going to be a good'un or a world of pain.  If it does drive well you'll fall hook line and sinker and purchase price and ongoing TLC will be forgotten in the blindness of the devoted.

David

Like any old car:

- does it drive
- is the structure sound
- any expensive bits missing
- estimate what work YOU want to do on it (there's no "official" standard)
- is the total affordable
- alternatives for the total spend

http://www.auto-invest.co.uk/vehicle_detail.asp?VehicleID=138

Seems to tick all the boxes !!   MUST be worth a look, if only for the education...

Something else to consider is painting the worst bits only.   There ARE still painters out there who can match and blend.   What makes a "complete" respray so expensive is taking the car to bits to do it, so the question is can you sort the worst of the paint without taking the glass out wrestling with all that chrome?

David

Certainly looks better in these photos than in the metal, but as you say if need be just get the really bad bits repainted, at least you can see what you're getting for your money.

Brian
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Thanks chaps.  I know entirely what you mean about not being worried driving it in its current state. A definite plus point. Whilst that doesn't overly bother me, I really don't know about the pricing of this one. I do get the feeling it could be overpriced. Was talking (mailing) to a chap in Switzerland with what looks like a minter for sale - same colours but a 2.8, and he is wanting around £15 to £16k for it. He is the third owner. So although a large difference in cost, must be cheaper than taking one with what has, lets face it terrible paint, and trying to get it up to scratch. However, £16k is a lot different than £10k!!

And in the long run an awful lot less aggrevation and probably cheaper ;D
All boils down to can you afford, or do you want to spend the £16K.

Brian
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But don't forget inport duty and tax, as Switzerland isn't in the EEC. That would make a big difference in price. I have never driven a coupe, but have owned a GT and a GTL, both of which were fine cars. I had a ride (in the back!) in a coupe and was very impressed by the performance and comfort. Regards, John

The other question with the UK car is what is the REAL price...   The cars are sufficiently rare that there's no "market" as such so its only worth what you are willing to pay.  The vendor will also realise that serious interest doesn't walk through the door every day of the week.  The ticket in the window is just the start.

Do you trust yourself to JUST go and have a look then sleep on it or are you too impulsive?   Perhaps someone else in the club would be able to test drive and look it over for you?

David

Being that it's been kicking around for sale since November that I know of, and how long before? I would of thought there would be a pretty good prospect of haggling on the price.

Brian
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The Swiss car is still on French plates, well Monaco plates I think. I assume a Monaco (Monaconese?) car would be subject to import tax?

Thankfully (?) the one in the UK is 100s of miles away from me so impulse buying not an option. But, whilst they don't come up every day, there is no point buying one which doesn't feel right.

Whatever price is paid, I can semi justify it in that it will never/shouldn't depreciate. So might be "investing" whatever amount but not throwing it away as such, which I can live with. I couldn't live with paying £16k for a new tin box for it to be worth £5k 2 or 3 years later.

I'll keep looking. Thanks to all for words of encouragement and advice. The right car will come along at some point.