A B20 Story

[Parisien]

Thats very useful Noel, hoping to put it to good use during the rebuild. So everything listed will correspond to a modern part number of another make or is SKF still on the go?


P

[ColinMarr]

Just over 20 years ago when I needed such a bearing they were completely unobtainable as new items from all the usual stockists. I was lucky and was able to buy a new/unused RIV one (from Tim Burrett I think). The alternative then was to have an old bearing rebuilt with freshly ground grooves and larger balls. My local bearing supplier (sadly now closed down) could have had this done for about the same price as the unobtainable new one. This might still be an option if you can find a good old fashioned supplier.

Colin

[Charles]

Another source is Classic Lancia in Holland - http://www.classiclancia.com/car-parts/index.php?route=product%2Fsearch&keyword=aurelia&category_id=0&description=on - they are not cheap but their stuff is very good.  I got new rear hub bearings for my Flaminia from them at a not unreasonable price.

[Parisien]

Great site, they stock a few B12 items have emailed them


P

[Parisien]

Said they didn't have anything for a B12....but I've had to contradict them!!!!





P

[the.cern]

To quote the late Ronnie Barker in Open All Hours, 'It's been a funny sort of a day ....'

We continued attacking the engine peripherals, I had already removed the cover plate and sprung retaining clip from the front of the fan and Jim had made the tool to remove the retaining ring to expose the pair of bearings in the fan. So, off came the water pump, it was separated from the fan which was then heated to help release the bearings. The circlip was both a surprise and reluctant to shift, but we prevailed and whole has been dismantled and cleaned. The rear casting, adjacent to where the impeller turns, regrettably has been damaged but, unless a replacement can be sourced at a reasonable cost, a repair will be attempted. Two new bearings have been ordered and we should have it rebuilt soon.

In the meantime, Jim is making the spanner to remove the inner retaining ring for the rear wheel bearing which will allow the right hand hub to be fully dismantled. The outer retaining ring finally succumbed to heat (a lot of heat) and a drift with a big hammer. Two of the lugs have been damaged but will be built up with weld and filed to the original profile. I will use Jim's C spanner when the hubs are re-built as I feel the ring need not be that tight.

With regard to the Panhard rod silentbloc bushes, the tool made for the Appia rear spring bushes is mis-sized by about Imm but an easy fix (said Jim). So, hopefully not too long before that is re-furbished.

Rear wheel bearings, thank you everyone who has suggested suppliers and options. I have obtained prices and it looks like Enrico at Cavalitto will be the chosen supplier, the oil seals should be available off the shelf in the UK.

The day ended on a high when I just saved the vacuum cleaner from going up in flames. Jim was extremely rude, all I did was drop the hose into a tub of Gunk while it was still sucking .... it could happen to anyone !!!

A small present from Jim, he has made 2 saddles for the trolley jacks, short (150mm) sections of channel of a suitable width with an appropriate 'pin', to replace the standard saddle. One for use when jacking under de Dion tube of the B20 and the other for the front axle beam of the B20 and the Appia, surprisingly these are the same width.

That's where we are at the moment, cleaning and priming the underside continues in between these other activities, variety is the spice ....

More to follow soon.

                    Andy

[DavidLaver]

I love stuff like those saddles - a pleasure every time when jacking up is the sort of job that's usually a nervous chore. 

David

[the.cern]

I have just realised that I had not given a credit for the jack saddles. 

Peter Harding was kind enough to give me the tip a couple of years ago. I had kept it in the back of my mind, always meaning to act. The prod came when I was jacking the front of the Appia, I was checking, as I always do, that the saddle was accurately positioned under the axle before taking the full weight of the car. To my horror I discovered that the saddle was actually under the crankcase. On the Appia the front axle is quite close to the crankcase and on this occasion I had misjudged it !!  That was a mistake I did not intend to make again, hence the request to Jim to make the bespoke saddles.  Thank you Peter.

                      Andy

[Kevin MacBride]

Plus on the Aurelia, you run the risk of catching the steering arm with the lever of a trolly jack. The front of the sump is quite close as well to the axle.

[the.cern]

It's that damned right hand rear wheel bearing that has been giving me the latest problems !!!!!

On 2nd Sept I said I hoped to have the right hand hub disassembled within a week,  on 10th Sept the tool was still not ready and now, the tool has been made but to no avail !!!!!!!! The photos tell the story, Jim made an extremely accurate tool that picks up the bearing retaining ring at every indent and it is very robust (well it is now!!).  We started off with a 700mm lever and were rather surprised when it did not move (given our experience with the same ring on the left side). A 1.2m lever was no better, heat didn't help, neither did  hitting it with a big hammer (Jim says that is simply to get its attention) which usually shocks things into submission. However, a lot of heat, a lot of getting its attention and the 1.2m lever got a result. The 1/2inch square hole in the 6mm plate that closed the end of the tool was now approximating to a circular hole, the steel had simply sheared, the jaws of the  1/2inch drive bar had opened up and its high tensile steel swivel pin had sheared. Put simply, we broke the tool and the ring showed no sign of shifting. Next step, cut down a large socket, weld it to the tool to provide a new 1/2 inch drive, yet more heat, yet more getting its attention (now with a 3lb hammer), a new drive bar and up the lever length to 1.5m. Result, the tool didn't break but Jim and I gave up in disgust, absolutely knackered and the ring did even show any sign of even thinking about moving !!!!!!!!

Next step is tomorrow attack it with a 3/4inch drive impact wrench, I will update progress as and when !!!

Photos will be in a separate post.

                          Andy

[lancialulu]

Andy

Not sure I can see the problem without photos but I had a "similar" problem trying to get the inner race of the front stub axle of my Gamma.

As it was separated from the car I took it to my friendly machine shop who ground it almost off then hit it with a cold chisel and it popped off.. The retaining ring on the hub carrier carrying the bearing was another matter entirely for them needing a 2m pole, heat and more time than they had thought for their "standard hour" they charge to replace wheel bearings. Anyway my Rosie is now silent on the roads....

Tim

[SanRemo78]

Any possibility that it's a left hand thread and you're trying to tighten it inadvertently?

Just a thought!

Guy

[Charles]

Tim, for the record, Lancia were kind enough to put two small holes through the stub axle of the Gamma so that removing the inner race is simply a matter of sticking a drift into each hole in turn and giving it a couple of taps and off drops the inner race (everyone loves a clever disk eh!!!). Beta is the same but nor the Delta as I recall.

[lancialulu]

Charles - must admit I didnt see any cunning holes - will look next time, albeit I could never have got the retaining ring off so to get the lot done for £33.60 I felt was good value.

Tim

[the.cern]

Guy, thank you for the thought, it had occurred to me, but there is no reason for it to be a left hand thread. However, we did give it a quick try that way just in case, after all, the maximum effort required in these matters is usually just to break the 'seal' that tends to build up between components over the years and sometimes tightening does that more easily.

Tim, its the retaining ring in the hub carrier that is the problem, just as your chaps found. We have only a butane blowtorch, not oxy-acetylene so cannot do a 'proper' job when it comes to heating. Your £33.60 was well spent !!!!

Anyway, I am delighted to say that it is off !!!! Great relief. 5mins with the 1/2inch air impact wrench followed by 5mins with the 3/4 wrench and then a further 5mins with the 1/2 in and it slowly and very reluctantly started to move. There was no sign of corrosion on the threads, so I don't know what the problem was, but its not a problem now!!!! Jim's magnificent bearing puller eased the bearing off, it is in very poor condition and new ones will be ordered, probably from Classiclancia, although Enrico is 'in with a shout'.

Front wheel bearings have been stripped out and will be replaced although they were done some 3000 mls ago, but then it stood for decades and that point loading from one, or maybe two balls, on the races causes terminal problems that usually show up just a few hundred miles later.

I'm sorry about the continued lack of photos but I have to find a way of re-sizing them. They are currently 1.2mbytes and the limit is 1.0, the help desk should arrive soon !!!

                                   Andy