Flavia Coupe Servo Problem

[lancialulu]

Bellisimo!

[chriswgawne]

That's a nice looking car with, presumably, no history of corrosion etc having spent its life in Portugal? I would like to see pictures of the other  cars you list as well if possible please. Is the early Fulvia Sedan a single carb model maybe?
Chris

[DavidLaver]

You're a lucky man - both the car and the landscape.

I hadn't realised it was an injected car, a rare beast indeed.  Any issues with that side of things?

David

[DavidLaver]

Out of interest what is the white rectangular box next to the rear view mirror?

[stanley sweet]

What a lovely way to spend a day. Flavia's have such class.

[chriswgawne]

David,
I bet that box is the Portuguese equivalent of the Italian Telepass for motorway tolls. The Motorway from Lisbon going South can accept these I believe.
Chris

[peteracs]

Ditto for France, saves so much time....

Peter

[Seara Cardoso]

Thank you all for the kind words! 

That's a nice looking car with, presumably, no history of corrosion etc having spent its life in Portugal? I would like to see pictures of the other  cars you list as well if possible please. Is the early Fulvia Sedan a single carb model maybe?
Chris

Yes beeing in Portugal it has almost no corrosion at all, the car only had one previous owner, and was painted once, it isn't as good as it seems in the pictures but acceptable to maintain it this way!
The 1963 Fulvia Sedan is a single carb version! Its commission number is actually 1246 witch makes it the 246th Fulvia to leave the factory, I believe its the first one registered in Portugal!!

Of course I can post pictures of the other cars, as I'm recent to the forum where is it more convenient to post the pictures?

You're a lucky man - both the car and the landscape.

I hadn't realised it was an injected car, a rare beast indeed.  Any issues with that side of things?

David

Thank you, I bought the car in 2009, and the injection wasn't that good, the car ran nice if cold or hot, in between it wasn't so smooth. I remember starting the car after being parked for one hour and it ran only in 3 cylinders for some miles. I believe all of this was due to the car being stooped for many years before being sold to me, the only thing I did was to apply a thermostat (I found out it was missing) to keep the temperature steady at 70º. Since then I can tell you that the more miles I put in the car the better it behaves, and now is almost perfect, really really smooth drives in the car 

Out of interest what is the white rectangular box next to the rear view mirror?

And yes the rectangular box is for the "Via Verde", to pay for tollbooths without having to stop, it saves a lot of time! I usually take it out when not in use but I forgot to do so this time!

[fay66]

Thank you all for the kind words! 

That's a nice looking car with, presumably, no history of corrosion etc having spent its life in Portugal? I would like to see pictures of the other  cars you list as well if possible please. Is the early Fulvia Sedan a single carb model maybe?
Chris

Yes beeing in Portugal it has almost no corrosion at all, the car only had one previous owner, and was painted once, it isn't as good as it seems in the pictures but acceptable to maintain it this way!
The 1963 Fulvia Sedan is a single carb version! Its commission number is actually 1246 witch makes it the 246th Fulvia to leave the factory, I believe its the first one registered in Portugal!!

Of course I can post pictures of the other cars, as I'm recent to the forum where is it more convenient to post the pictures?

You're a lucky man - both the car and the landscape.

I hadn't realised it was an injected car, a rare beast indeed.  Any issues with that side of things?

David

Thank you, I bought the car in 2009, and the injection wasn't that good, the car ran nice if cold or hot, in between it wasn't so smooth. I remember starting the car after being parked for one hour and it ran only in 3 cylinders for some miles. I believe all of this was due to the car being stooped for many years before being sold to me, the only thing I did was to apply a thermostat (I found out it was missing) to keep the temperature steady at 70º. Since then I can tell you that the more miles I put in the car the better it behaves, and now is almost perfect, really really smooth drives in the car 

Out of interest what is the white rectangular box next to the rear view mirror?

And yes the rectangular box is for the "Via Verde", to pay for tollbooths without having to stop, it saves a lot of time! I usually take it out when not in use but I forgot to do so this time!

Hi Ricardo,
Can you post photos of your Normale Berlina on here please, Normale's are rare in most places except for Italy, there is a very nice on in the Netherlands.
The donor car for my 2c was a UK Normale that someone in the club found for me.
In 2004 I was with other Lancia's with Club Vincenzo Lancia from Germany, run by Frank Dehler as we met up with the Portuguese Lancia owners at Esphino with the local club while the local Lancia Dealer sponsored the Event while in Esphino.
We were on the motorway on the way to Braga while all of us had to stop to pay at the toll booth, the Portuguese contingent just sailed trhough, we wondered what they were doing, but found out later about the box, typical Lancia owners they didn't slow down for us but just assumed we would catch them up, which I did on a downhill section showing 90mph on my 2c's speedo.

Brian
8227

[ColinMarr]

Ricardo,

I am pleased that someone is still running a petrol injection Flavia - there must be very few still in existence. Presumably yours still has the original mechanical Kugelfisher injection system. My Flavia was a 1967 Vignale convertible with Kugelfisher and it gave me lots of high performance pleasure in the 1980s.

There are some potential problems with this system to be aware of. One is that if the car is left unused for a long period, the ‘o’ ring seals on the plungers stick and won’t return. It sounds like you are out of this problem, but it makes sense to use an additive in the fuel to help provide some lubrication to those parts that only otherwise see pure petrol.

Another problem is that for the injection system to work the petrol pump needs to feed it at much higher pressure (3 or 4 atmospheres!) than a carburettor system. This pressure is at the limit of the original pump design and the pump needs to be 100% good to achieve this. Any fuel vaporisation because of high temperatures can cause the pump to fail --- and the engine stops!

Also, this high pressure pump strains the flexible pipes and joints that lead from fuel pump via filter to the injector unit so that any tiny leak of fuel into the engine bay spells disaster. Quite a few Flavias went up in smoke for this reason and others were converted to carburettors to avoid it.

Colin 

[Seara Cardoso]

Hi Ricardo,
Can you post photos of your Normale Berlina on here please, Normale's are rare in most places except for Italy, there is a very nice on in the Netherlands.
The donor car for my 2c was a UK Normale that someone in the club found for me.
In 2004 I was with other Lancia's with Club Vincenzo Lancia from Germany, run by Frank Dehler as we met up with the Portuguese Lancia owners at Esphino with the local club while the local Lancia Dealer sponsored the Event while in Esphino.
We were on the motorway on the way to Braga while all of us had to stop to pay at the toll booth, the Portuguese contingent just sailed trhough, we wondered what they were doing, but found out later about the box, typical Lancia owners they didn't slow down for us but just assumed we would catch them up, which I did on a downhill section showing 90mph on my 2c's speedo.

Brian
8227

Hello Brian, I'll create a new topic for the berlina as I have some advice to ask regarding the engine. In the meanwhile here is picture of it!

So I knew your car before! I had crossed this text from you a while ago and knew the car from some internet pictures! http://www.vincenzo-adventure-tours.com/INFO/2004%20-%20Portugal.pdf

I always found amazing to make a big trip in a 2C, what was the average speed you kept on motorway or off the motorway? I hope to make a big trip in mine on day, but it struggles when climbing!

I only participated in the Lancia Club Vincenzo meet in Portugal in 2001 and in 2002, and this year they are making another Tour here, were are organizing an event and will meet them on the 25th of April.

Ricardo

[Seara Cardoso]

Ricardo,

I am pleased that someone is still running a petrol injection Flavia - there must be very few still in existence. Presumably yours still has the original mechanical Kugelfisher injection system. My Flavia was a 1967 Vignale convertible with Kugelfisher and it gave me lots of high performance pleasure in the 1980s.

There are some potential problems with this system to be aware of. One is that if the car is left unused for a long period, the ‘o’ ring seals on the plungers stick and won’t return. It sounds like you are out of this problem, but it makes sense to use an additive in the fuel to help provide some lubrication to those parts that only otherwise see pure petrol.

Another problem is that for the injection system to work the petrol pump needs to feed it at much higher pressure (3 or 4 atmospheres!) than a carburettor system. This pressure is at the limit of the original pump design and the pump needs to be 100% good to achieve this. Any fuel vaporisation because of high temperatures can cause the pump to fail --- and the engine stops!

Also, this high pressure pump strains the flexible pipes and joints that lead from fuel pump via filter to the injector unit so that any tiny leak of fuel into the engine bay spells disaster. Quite a few Flavias went up in smoke for this reason and others were converted to carburettors to avoid it.

Colin 

Hello Colin

Thank you, an injection Vignale is ultra rare, amazing!!

Yes for now I had no problems, I had a small fuel leak from the unit but is was so easy to repair that I forgot to mention it! What kind of additive do you recommend? I want to prevent future problems!

As for the fuel pump I bought the car with the original unit, but I was having problems, the yellow (low fuel pressure) light was sometimes coming on until it eventually stopped working. Seeing no possible repair my mechanic at the time fitted another pump, a modern one, near the fuel tank, I think its a good option as it runs cooler this way.
Are you certain about the fuel pump pressure? I had read somewhere it was about 1-2atm, but never confirmed it. I'm asking it as I do not trust the pump that was fitted and I'm looking for an alternative, It gave me no problems regarding the pressure but sometimes it makes weird noises and it already stopped twice (I have to hammer it to make it work again ). I lost contact with my mechanic so I don't know what tipe of pump was fitted, I think I'm going to try to measure the pressure as is now.
I replaced the rubber fuel lines, but they really are subjected to high pressures!

Ricardo

[stanley sweet]

Seara - that's a beautiful Berlina. You have a very nice collection.

Brian - that was some trip! The Mondovi week seemed longer than it was so the two week Portugese trip must have seemed like forever.

[fay66]

Hi Ricardo,
Can you post photos of your Normale Berlina on here please, Normale's are rare in most places except for Italy, there is a very nice on in the Netherlands.
The donor car for my 2c was a UK Normale that someone in the club found for me.
In 2004 I was with other Lancia's with Club Vincenzo Lancia from Germany, run by Frank Dehler as we met up with the Portuguese Lancia owners at Esphino with the local club while the local Lancia Dealer sponsored the Event while in Esphino.
We were on the motorway on the way to Braga while all of us had to stop to pay at the toll booth, the Portuguese contingent just sailed trhough, we wondered what they were doing, but found out later about the box, typical Lancia owners they didn't slow down for us but just assumed we would catch them up, which I did on a downhill section showing 90mph on my 2c's speedo.

Brian
8227

Hello Brian, I'll create a new topic for the berlina as I have some advice to ask regarding the engine. In the meanwhile here is picture of it!

So I knew your car before! I had crossed this text from you a while ago and knew the car from some internet pictures! http://www.vincenzo-adventure-tours.com/INFO/2004%20-%20Portugal.pdf

I always found amazing to make a big trip in a 2C, what was the average speed you kept on motorway or off the motorway? I hope to make a big trip in mine on day, but it struggles when climbing!

I only participated in the Lancia Club Vincenzo meet in Portugal in 2001 and in 2002, and this year they are making another Tour here, were are organizing an event and will meet them on the 25th of April.

Ricardo

Hello Ricardo,
If you were on the 2001 trip we must have met, simon and myself flew over for the meeting as "Fay" wasn't ready yet for her first big Continental tour, a Lancia was arranged for us and we borrowed a 1.6 Lybra Estate from a young lady who worked for Fiat.
Never actually worked out the average speed as we stopped at places of interest, but pushed on at a brisk pace while on the move, off the Motorways we were usually running at 60mph-70 mph depending on the roads, many of which as is usual in France were straight, so you could get a move on if you wanted to, and on motorways 70-80mph.
Probably the best run was from Salamanca right across Spain in 30c heat, it was so hot we were sitting on towels, and I had to hang one on my door window as my right was burning as it was so hot, the drive up over the Pyrenees then down the other side to St jean Pied de Port was also very memorable, the longest drive was the 490 miles home on the last day, all the actual running days were long days with up to 10-11 hours a day driving.
My comments regarding overheating was more due to the gauge reading high than an actual problem, something that I've only manage to sort out in the last couple of years.
 
I have a similar problem as yourself with hill climbing as everyone on the 'Fulvia Knights Rallye' in 2013 can testify, but she goes like the clappers down the other side

You're a bit worse off than I am as I've got best part of a 20BHP advantage over your Normale, coming back over the Alps from Turin in 2006 to Grenoble my fuel consumption was something like 14mpg on the climb due to the low gearing, and the fact that she weighs about a tonne in weight doesn't help.
Your Normale looks lovely, did you have it in 2001 as I don't recollect seeing it? any chance of emailing me more photos, and email me if you have anything I can help you with.

As long as you prepare yourself and your Fulvia properly you shouldn't have any problems with extended touring distances, I always carry a lot of spares, working on the principle if you've got it with you the chances are you won't need it, but if you do, you've got it anyway!
Breakdown and recovery insurance is a must, at least that way if you do break down, you can get home

in 1999 the mileage on the clock was 27.000 miles, recently I've doubled that mileage in my ownership, and more than 1/3rd has been  covered on trips to France,Spain, Portugal, Italy, Belgium & Holland.

When you meet up on the 25th please give everyone my best regards.
Brian
8227

[fay66]

Seara - that's a beautiful Berlina. You have a very nice collection.

Brian - that was some trip! The Mondovi week seemed longer than it was so the two week Portugese trip must have seemed like forever.

Stan,
could have done with another couple of weeks !

Brian
8227