Progress report

[stanley sweet]

Lovely! This is nice too...........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qnbM6KSNns

Must stop watching................now I want to fit Dellortos etc too.

[RobD]

Great sound...those 1.3s can be made to go quite well!!

Got to hand it to yer man at Targa Florio classics, he hunts out and posts some great videos on You Tube.

[DavidLaver]

Maybe ten years ago there was a 1300 Fulvia coupe at HSCC meetings that kept all the 1600s honest.  From memory the builder and driver were not the same guy and the builder was from near Oxford.  I can remember it hanging its inside rear high in the slow corners.  Can anyone help me out as to who they would have been and when?

David

[frankxhv773t]

The manifold is coming from Omicron and I would imagine it will be sand cast from what is known as loose patterns [I could be wrong and it might be investment cast, but I would doubt it] Sandcasting components in small batches can often introduce small variances between individual components, this is perfectly acceptable from a QC issue in this application.

Nobody seems to have commented about casting but the one pictured is surely welded up from tube and the manifold flange will be plasma cut steel plate to a high degree of accuracy. However, along with the rough surfaced inlet tracts, I have come across manifold flanges with a deliberate step to the ports to encourage swirl.

you pays your money and you make your choice.

[RobD]

The one in the picture you are referring to is the exhaust manifold, not the inlet. And yes that will be fabricated...

This is the one we're discussing, and this looks like a sandcast item to me.

[RobD]

Lifted from the 'CUC 20H Fanalone thread:

He also machine tapered the two faces of the inlet manifold which has lowered the carbs, had the radiator re-cored reducing the height by 20mm and lowered the height of the water manifold and the temperature sender. All of  which has resulted in the bonnet shutting level with the wing tops without fouling the carbs and radiator.  "

Robin.

Hi Robin,
That's a very interesting point about machining the mating faces of the manifold. It should be possible to pinch a couple of degrees off the angle of the carbs by altering the relative angle of the manifold mating faces. A couple of degrees could potentially equate to 15 or 20mm off the carb height.
 The exact amount to machine off could be established by loosely assembling the carbs and manifold on to the head and leaving a bit of slack in the upper mounting bolts allowing the carbs to droop. If they clear the bonnet then all that needs to be done is to measure the gap, divide it by two and machine an appropriate sized wedge off each mating face.
In theory you'd only need to machine one face but it that would depend on how much meat is on the mounting flange. Machining the face which mates to the head [as opposed to the carbs] will give the most bang for your buck in terms of reducing the overall height of the carbs.
I like it!
Omicron's advice regarding the rad was a little less complicated than having it re-cored. They suggested altering the length of the upper mounting strap and tilting the rad forward a few degrees. Obviously there's no clearance issues with the rad to bonnet , it the rad to carb clearance which is compromised by the new manifold.

[the.cern]

All interesting stuff. So if you dimple the entire bodywork of your Fulvia with a hammer you get an extra few mph out of it!

           
I had a Volvo 265 in 1987 which, as everyone knows has the aerodynamic qualities of a sand faced fletton. The hurricane caused a large number of tiles from the house roof to be deposited on the Volvo, giving it the required appearance of a golf ball. It made no apparent difference. If it does not enhance the aerodynamics of a 265 then I fear it will fail with everything!!!

                                 Andy

[RobD]

All interesting stuff. So if you dimple the entire bodywork of your Fulvia with a hammer you get an extra few mph out of it!

Stanley's post reminded me of the Father Ted classic when Ted planished an entire car a hammer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mdwAkWvWMw

[stanley sweet]

I must admit I had that in mind too. One of my favourite lines 'I thought I had it there for a moment'.

Did Omicron give you any sort of idea of power increase from the carbs and exhaust? I take it you're leaving the cams alone for the time being?

Here's a photo of a 1600 I found. Without checking against my car, it looks as though the relationship between the standard radiator and alternator etc is all pretty standard and there's still space for the original dipstick inbetween. According to the caption these are 48's. Perhaps you won't need to move the radiator?

[lancialulu]

Stan that HF has a manifold adaptor which has different geometry.

I have a pair of 45's on such an adaptor which I have yet to fit as I like the standard 42's too much........

[RobD]

I like the colour co-ordinated bungee cord retaining the battery!

Interesting to note that car also seems to have adequate distributor clearance, Tim, is this due to having the aforementioned adapter?

Stanley, in answer to your query, I haven't a clue what power increases could be expected and am always skeptical about bolt-on power claims. In my experience most amateur-modified vehicles [and a few professional-modified ones!] tend to go slower than stock. This is because it's common for people to bolt on stuff which looks sexy but then fail to address the really important stuff such as ignition and carb timing, not to mention the general overall health of the engine.

The main motive behind the carb change is to make the car a bit easier to set up and optimise due to the availability of jets/chokes etc It's also dead easy to change jets on DHLA/DCOE type carbs.

If you asked me what my target power output would be, I would be delighted if I could get a 1300 Fulvia putting out a reliable 105 bhp at the wheels with a commensurate increase in torque. To me, that would be a realistic and potentially achievable objective, others might disagree.

 The general plan is to get it performing well on the carbs and exhaust and if I feel some extra power would be handy then cams and pistons are an option for next year. Small , incremental improvements is what I'm aiming for.
 

[stanley sweet]

Well, the original 1.3 HF's put out 101bhp and they went pretty well.

[Dilambdaman]

Lifted from the 'CUC 20H Fanalone thread:

"Jonathan has stripped and rebuilt the 48 Dellortos using comprehensive overhaul kits, checked the pump filter, overhauled the Filter King fitting new gaskets and spring, fitted a new set of points and she's running better than ever.  Smiley Another case of not knowing which was at fault or maybe it was a mix of all.

He also machine tapered the two faces of the inlet manifold which has lowered the carbs, had the radiator re-cored reducing the height by 20mm and lowered the height of the water manifold and the temperature sender. All of  which has resulted in the bonnet shutting level with the wing tops without fouling the carbs and radiator.  "

Robin.

Herewith a couple of photos of the carbs (48 Dellorto) on the Fanalone after Jonathan's modifications. The radiator is pulled as far forward as possible by the top rubber mount otherwise the large alternator which is fitted would foul the rad core. We've fitted a metal plate to the core to make absolutely certain that the alternator dosen't ever hole it!

Robin

[lancialulu]

Rob the adapter bolts onto the existing inlet manifold so clears the distributor. Jason and Louise use this on their racy 1600 Sport with good effect even though the inlet tracts are considerably increased.

Re power to wheels this would be impressive as manufacturer power is at flywheel and I have seen 15% power loss quoted through the drive train....

[RobD]

I'd have to agree Tim, I didn't appreciate Lancia BHP figures were quoted at the flywheel, I'd assumed the figures I'd seen for the various HF derivatives were taken at the road wheels and assumed a carefully built unit of similar spec must start to approach the factory figures.
 I shall downgrade my estimate accordingly! If we get 90bhp at the wheels I'll be very happy... this would equate to approx 15% increase.