Brake bleeding fulvias

[chris]

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[Scarpia]

there is no obligation to answer on the forum ; its a matter of choice.

However once information is on here it may save lots of people over the years not being any wiser and all needing to just ring for 2 or 3 minutes for the same information.My reasoning in raising a topic like this is to solve a problem whilst fully aware that this is a common struggle for many people.I also specifically wish to increase the technical content on the forum to make it as useful as it is entertaining.

[ncundy]

Couldn't agree more Scapia. From memory there is a small pilot hole in the front chamber of the master cylinder. The chamber below this is very difficult to prime after the cylinder has been drained. The advice to assemble wet is sensible. I have always filled the master cylinder on the bench and with the actor shaft in the "pedal depressed" position. When released there is then a vacuum in the chamber which helps with the priming. A few pumps of the shaft and you can see the fluid squirting out of the two ports. A little bit messy but you then know everything works before putting it back.
I wonder how many people have re-fitted a master cylinder, been unable to prime it and then taken it off again because they have thought they have assembled it incorrectly ! Thhis avoids all of that.

On the topic of filling the system, when I was designing engine and hydrostatic installations we would always fill from the bottom upwards using a pump. A bit more important in these types of system where cavitation will kill a system quickly if air is not evacuated - so maybe overkill, but I  I may try this when I get round to mine.

[Scarpia]

Thanks Neil, my master cylinder is dry so I'll have a look and see if I can try this procedure.

[chris]

Dear Scarpia - Firstly may I apologise for not reading your original post in this thread - I was reacting to another post contained within this thread - nothing to do with your first post.         

there is no obligation to answer on the forum ; its a matter of choice.         re:- "no obligation" - I note that you appeared to add a post as a reaction to my post, so, Touche!

However once information is on here it may save lots of people over the years not being any wiser and all needing to just ring for 2 or 3 minutes for the same information.My reasoning in raising a topic like this is to solve a problem whilst fully aware that this is a common struggle for many people.I also specifically wish to increase the technical content on the forum to make it as useful as it is entertaining.

                Bravo, is all tht I had better say - but you (and ncundy) seem to be forgetting that all these posts are deleted after a relatively short time, so i'm sorry to say that your efforts would appear to be in vain - (I don't know if there is an archiving system in place that I have missed?)

[chris]

Dear Neil - Re :- "agreeing with Sca(r)pia" - I am assuming you are talking about an early Series 1 master cylinder (?) as later cars could have a cylinder feed hole (the 4mm one?) in both chambers, there later being as many as 3 (such holes) in the rear cylinder, making bleeding easier. Good to see you have taken the trouble to add your bleeding experiences - the "actor" shaft that you refer to, is that like an actuation shaft? Best Regards Chris

[Scarpia]

Chris,
I really don't understand what your issue is. You joined the discussion, but complained you "wished you hadn't bothered" as you didn't want to spend time posting and would really rather people phone you.That's up to you and I understand it in a way because personal contact often does work better. But if others wish to help and continue the discussion that's their choice also.As for an archive, that a whole other discussion......

[chris]

Will respond to you in a p.m. scarpia - I have explained once - and also apologised - I joined the discussion, but was not responding to the original post. You appeared to then respond to my post (which was not aimed at your first post - do you follow?) and then I realised that I had not read the thread from the beginning, and now had to address your question also - a question that I have replied to literally dozens of times. If you knew me, you would realize that, of course I would not hinder the efforts of anyone on this forum to help explain a repair procedure (as long as it was fairly accurate and did not put anyone at risk) - far from it - I would actively encourage it, it saves me a job and new friendships and occasionally, methods can be forged. Chris

[inthedark]

Hi Chris & Scarpia,
It really is time we had a Technical directory so that misunderstandings could be avoided.
It can be wearing when you have to make long posts explaining in simple terms 'how to'
especially when you have covered the same subject several times before. I like Chris
tend to prefer a one to one explanation by phone rather than post to the forum which
can be very time consuming.
best regards to you both
Geoff 'the colonel'
(and I'm very very sober)

[Scarpia]

100% agreed Geoff.
see my posts electronic archiving and countless others over the last year(s). But we can't even seem to get copies of the committee minutes on here (and that is at least forseen already) so I won't hold my breath . Now if you don't all mind , I'm just off to bleed my brakes....

[ncundy]

You little bleeder ................

[Scarpia]

I've been called worse..I'll settle for that!

[nistri]

In my experience it is difficult to bleed the Fulvia brakes using vacuum pumps applied to the bleed nipples. Much more reliable is to apply gentle positive pressure to the master cylinder.

Again, others may disagree with me, but I always completely empty the master cylinder when replacing the brake fluid. Of course, if there is a lot of old debris in the brake pots, this is not going to be shifted out unless the calipers are stripped down and carefully cleaned.

Fulvia brake pots (S1 and S2) frequently build up rust under the rubber covers which are often damaged by a combination of factors like dirt, high temp, poor quality rubber and incorrect fitting. This of course has nothing to do with brake bleeding but it can affect the brake cylinder movements and pressure on the brake pads.

Finally, on S1 pots the small steel sphere under the bleed screw can rust badly making difficult to bleed the caliper and even causing a fluid leak. A bicycle shop or a bearing retailer can usually provide a similar sphere very cheaply.

[fay66]

 For the sake of clarity I've added this diagram for those who are not familiar with the Fulvia Brakes, this is the Dunlop set up used on Series 1 cars, the sphere Andrea refers to is highlighted in yellow.

Brian Hilton
8227

[ncundy]

When I stripped the brakes on my car (S1 Fanalone) in addition to the sphere there was a small circular spacer (about 2mm thick). I assumed that they sit under the ball (between the ball and the bleed channel, and the ball butts into the recess in the bleed nipple. They are obviously designed to go there as one side is formed with a recess to house the ball, but they are not shown in the TAV drg, nor in any of the Dunlop or Girling manuals I have. I put them back as I found them - any ideas on this ??